#65 Mental Health and Wellness for Graduate Students w Jennifer Harrison

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[00:00:21] Jennifer: So I am the founder and CEO of Read Write Perfect. And that is a company that provides a dissertation coaching services. I'm a PhD myself. I love being a coach and I love kind of coming on podcasts and sharing, you know, tips and strategies that can help out students

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[00:00:46] Jennifer: So I'm teaching kind of always been what I've done like I think I knew when I was in elementary school that I wanted to be a teacher.

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[00:01:13] Jennifer: I could see that grad students were not getting the support that they needed from their institutions. Um, there'd been that shift to remote learning and everybody was struggling with it.

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[00:01:31] Natalie: Okay. And, oh, I know COVID COVID changed all of our lives, but especially if you were an educator going through that remote learning, was very difficult for our students.

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[00:01:55] Jennifer: The hardest challenge was mindset. I think it can be very easy to be employed in a job that feels secure. And that is the one that you mapped out in your head when you started your career. And to kind of take, take a leap into the unknown and do something different is a little bit scary and you don't know how it's going to work out and even if all the evidence is there in front of you that it's going to be a change for the better.

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[00:02:27] Natalie: Yeah. I'm really happy that you brought that up and I think that can resonate with a lot of the listeners because I think a lot of people plan their lives in a very linear way, right? You're like, you're, you're going to go to school. You're going to graduate. You're going to do this. You're going to do that. And so. It takes courage to be able to say I'm going to do something different that I had not originally planned and I'm going to leave a safe and secure and stable kind of position and step out on my own.

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[00:03:14] Natalie: So even if you go down a path that you find, you know, this is not working out, you can usually backpedal or, or course direct, but it's good to just explore and see what else is out there because you might be robbing yourself of something. even more joyful, even more rewarding than what you had before. So thank you for sharing that.

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[00:03:58] Natalie: But a lot of people are going to different schools and they might not have. Going right after undergrads, there might have been a period of time where they're away from school. So for different reasons, they might feel disconnected and feel a little bit isolated. And then if they're doing it online, it's even more of a challenge.

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[00:04:37] Jennifer: I'm going to actually tackle this. Two questions separately, one about isolation and one about building a support network, because I think they require different sets of strategies. The isolation, a lot of that I think comes down to your own proactiveness, like it can be very tempting to say, Oh, well, you know, they're the people around me and then that's it.

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[00:05:15] Jennifer: Um, when it comes to isolation, I'd say first thing is be really strict about your work life balance. And this one comes from looking at the students that I work with and seeing what they struggle with. Most of them feel that drive to push, push, push, push, push all day. They're You know, 10 12 hours a day, working late into the night, getting up early in the morning, getting back to work.

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[00:06:04] Jennifer: And so I would say engage in affirmative behaviors, um, talk when you are with people, use that time to talk about what's going well or, um, something completely different to work so that you are. Getting real connection from that time. And I would also say that you should keep your degree in perspective and goal map for your life, not for your career, not for your degree.

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[00:06:48] Jennifer: And you'll, you'll feel a lot better about taking that time to Spend with your parents or spend with your kids or go out on a date with your partner or whatever it might be. So kind of those are, those are like baseline suggestions when it comes to isolation and changing your mindset about isolation.

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[00:07:27] Natalie: And I always talk to my clients about that too, but what is it that you want for your life? And you have to realize when when you get hyper focused on your goal, And you kind of are in a bubble. You're not realizing that everything around you is actually being neglected. You're neglecting your relationships with your family, with your loved ones, even with your own self, because you're just super focused.

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[00:08:07] Natalie: But I also want people to hold their well being in their hands as well. And I like what you said about situate. How would that degree impact your life? Where would it sit within the rest of your life? Because that one accomplishment can't be everything. Right. And I think a lot of times, a lot of people put their worth and their value into a specific role or into a specific degree or into a specific

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[00:08:47] Jennifer: In terms of building a support network, I would say think outside the box about what support is. And who can provide it. I think when we think about support network we think in professional terms like oh I'm going to have my supervisor I'll have the chair of the program, or I would actually say think outside of your program and think outside of your institution, when it comes to seeking support so first one is kind of a note.

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[00:09:26] Jennifer: First thing I'd say, seek external help. So that could be mentors, it could be other students, it could be writing centers, it could even be things like YouTube videos, it could be professional editors and coaches, anybody that you need to learn what it is you need to learn. Don't think that you have to know everything to be a grad student, like that your worth in that program is that you already know how to do things.

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[00:10:03] Jennifer: And that what will happen is you'll have those people around as supports who can help you and they'll usually end up teaching you more than you think you needed them for. And then the other one obviously is your, your people, your friends, your family, your colleagues, your peers, all those people that you hold around you because they make you feel good.

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[00:10:36] Jennifer: focus that you have who can help you to not let it take over your life. So you can chat through your work with them and your progress with them. Like I said, make it about the positives. You can turn to them for moral support if you're feeling anxious or you're feeling down. And then this is the one that everybody neglects.

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[00:11:12] Jennifer: Now is your time of life when you're in the middle of this very stressful thing that you can call on the people who love you to do those kind of things and they'll know that you'll pay them back later. Um, yeah, no, that will help you forwards and keep those relationships alive.

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[00:11:32] Natalie: You know, I remember when my cousin was doing her PhD and she had two children, she had two children through the time she, uh, was doing her PhD. So can you imagine she has these young babies as he's trying to write her dissertation and it can be a lot. And in order, sometimes people think that they can't pursue.

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[00:12:09] Natalie: And you bunker down and you kind of forget everybody exists. bring them in and say, Hey, this is what I'm working on today, or this is the chapter I'm on. Um, I find that people are actually, they want to be engaged, your family and friends, maybe not too hardcore. You don't need to give them all the details of your thesis or all the details of your dissertation, but people are generally interested and supportive of you, right?

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[00:13:07] Natalie: over time. And this can be very stressful as you're trying to plan out your life as a student and think how do I align myself now for, you know, a future job or future role. So how can prospective graduate students, or people who are going to potentially go through a career change or a career transition, how can they ensure that their voices align with the future trends rather than current circumstances?

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[00:13:50] Jennifer: But then when it comes to practical suggestions, kind of people sort of say, Oh, um, it's communication, it's time management, it's organization. Those are the things you need. Those are kind of meaningless terms. Like we all know roughly what they mean, but you know, how does that really translate into industry work?

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[00:14:26] Jennifer: And I think a lot of employers and a lot of industries find that very valuable. And a graduate program is the perfect place To develop that because it's nothing but criticism and feedback. You know, you get it coming from all sides all the time. So really developing their skills to deal with criticism and feedback and then being able to show that you can do that is going to be so important.

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[00:15:09] Jennifer: Those are really important I think in industry because everybody. has a particular way of looking at a problem, but if you can bring a fresh look to it, that's going to be very important. And again, a graduate program is a good place to develop that because you are already thinking about problem solving.

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[00:15:44] Jennifer: If you can show that you can keep on top of a whole project. So that's like what makes things like organization and time management into real tangible things. It means can you manage a deadline? Can you keep people on track? Can you work out the budget for something? Um, do you know how they Put together different personalities to make an effective team, anything like that, that you can pick up through your graduate experience and show that you can do it, it's going to make you highly employable, no matter what field you go into, no matter what's happening in that field.

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[00:16:34] Jennifer: If you can show you can do that, you're going to be very attractive. And then the last one is forming and leveraging networks. So if you can show that you're able to do that, that you're good at doing that, you know, it's so valuable in industry. So if you can develop those kind of skills and focus on the opportunities that will enable you to show that you have those skills, um, that's gonna, you know, I think that's the best way to prepare yourself for whatever the future might bring in terms of employment.

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[00:17:44] Jennifer: So, they may not seem like Obvious things you want to do at the time, but they, those kinds of opportunities will help you build these skills that will then make you very employable.

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[00:18:15] Natalie: In your career journey, even if you pivot into different industries, these types of skills will still move with you, but now they're specific. And then, you know, what exactly that you can work on and continue to build. But it really starts with, as you said, growth mindset. You have to have that willingness to learn.

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[00:18:39] Jennifer: I would really emphasize there is networks like building and forming and leveraging networks, because if you are meeting the right people and engaging in the right conversations, then you're going to be the person or one of the people at the forefront of that change.

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[00:18:55] Natalie: Yes, that's a really good point too. And I think networking and just having the network and nurturing it from time to time. You never know where it will take you in life. And sometimes, and I made this, this mistake when I was younger, I think I was like, okay, well, I'm moving into teaching.

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[00:19:31] Natalie: And I realized like, oh, I need to kind of have a. A network outside of my specific field and industry, and I wish I had maintained those, but without time, I was like, Oh, I don't need LinkedIn. I'm going to delete it. I'm going to delete these emails and contacts. So that's what I would really encourage anyone else to do too.

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[00:20:10] Natalie: Period. As I said, it is, I think a lot of times in life, we're thinking, well, what's in it for me? But I think if we kind of go from an angle of, well, how can I just be connected and form meaningful relationships with people and just recognize their humanity? How can I help them? Maybe there's an opportunity for them to help me, or we can just stay connected for the sake of connection.

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[00:20:56] Natalie: So what advice can you provide to help individuals cope with failures and setbacks constructively without jeopardizing their well being or motivation? Sure,

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[00:21:21] Jennifer: So they are already a good researcher, they're already a good writer. You know, they're only really there to research their topic and write about it, but there's nothing else that they really need to learn. And I've even seen students come in saying, I already know what the answer is to my research question.

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[00:21:51] Jennifer: You know, you're there to collect data and see what it tells you, not necessarily to already know what it's going to tell you. Um, so there are a lot of books and courses that you can do on mindset growth. Um, like a key name is Carol Dweck and any books. And of course is that you can find her a great resource.

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[00:22:40] Jennifer: People who go into higher education teaching don't necessarily have that training. And so, you know, it can be devastating when you spend all this time on a draft, you hand it in and then someone says, well, this is absolutely rubbish. Go and fix it. That's going to happen. Like there's no way around that.

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[00:23:13] Jennifer: This is what I need to know so that I can move forward. So it's kind of people aren't going to do that for you, like they're going to give you what they give you and it's going to be down to you to make something of it and make it useful for you. And then, finally, like the next step up from that is be willing to advocate for yourself because sometimes fail failures and setbacks aren't your fault.

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[00:23:55] Jennifer: That might mean declaring a disability that you've been diagnosed with. It might mean reporting an abusive supervisor and going through all the hassle that that entails, or requesting a new supervisor. It might mean insisting that you get an extension for medical reasons, even if they seem reluctant to give you one.

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[00:24:29] Natalie: You know, I really love, um, What you said there about just kind of knowing your rights and advocating for yourself because I have known several friends who have gone through their PhD programs and there's a lot that can happen because I mean you're in these programs for six, seven, it depends. It depends on the school depends on the program but you're in, in these programs for a long time.

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[00:25:16] Natalie: Um, because I think sometimes people feel like they're backed into a corner. They have to stick with their supervisor. They have to, um, accept being treated not well. They have to Except someone who doesn't even respond to their emails and give them feedback at all .

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[00:26:00] Natalie: They might be able to listen, but they don't know how to navigate, um, higher academia and, and the difficulties and the nuances and. Regulations, right, that are involved. And also there's a, you have to be strategic in the way in which you do things because you never want to get yourself blacklisted or get yourself into further problems.

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[00:26:42] Natalie: Uh, and you're not just putting yourself out there as a martyr and then you now are placing the consequences. So I, you know, I really, um, appreciate that and. I, I hope that anybody who's kind of in a maybe a difficult situation right now where they feel just stuck realizes that there could be other options, um, that you maybe not have, you may, you maybe haven't considered them before because you just didn't know.

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[00:27:24] Natalie: It's to encourage women to prioritize their wellbeing, to pour back into themselves, to honor their needs, and just to have more open conversations about their wellness journeys. Myself as a wellness coach, I'm supporting women, professionals, and entrepreneurs, and I see a lot of the experiences that People go through that women go through in particular that affect their well being and oftentimes people feel like they're alone.

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[00:28:06] Natalie: Definitely.

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[00:28:25] Jennifer: So that must be all in work. Um, when I was specifically when I was working in academia, I think was a real issue. So low pay, unpaid labor, virtually no job security, really long hours, lack of work life balance. All of that was kind of normalized. It was just what everybody did. It was expected of you. Um, and you were kind of looked at that funny if you suggested that maybe those weren't great things.

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[00:29:10] Jennifer: Like I assume nobody, nobody's going to be willing to hire me for better than what I've already got. And it took a combination of, um, being absolutely committed to having something better. And coaching, and then some self work to overcome those assumptions and to get myself to a better place so I needed a coach to tell me these things aren't true.

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[00:29:51] Jennifer: Like coaches know what they're doing. Um, I was one of those people who never asked for help with anything either. Like, I was so against having a coach. It's like, why do I need to pay somebody to tell me what to do? Like, I really needed a coach. I needed a coach to tell me what it was I should be focusing on and thinking about and having faith in from their own experience.

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[00:30:27] Jennifer: And they will be that, you know, even if you don't believe them when they say it, having that validation, I don't know, it does something to you psychologically that just pushes you that next step that you need to go.

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[00:30:42] Natalie: We hear our own voices very loudly. All the time. And even if we are positive thinkers. All of us have negative self talk within our brains, and it is very hard to kind of separate the negative self talk and figure out what is truth and what is a lie, because you just hear it all the time. So you just start to think that everything in your head is the actual truth.

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[00:31:28] Natalie: And that's where the action comes in, because you do have to take action. You do have to roll up your sleeves and do some work and say, I'm committed to transforming myself. I'm committed to. Growing as a person, I'm committed to shifting my mindset because I know the goals that I'm after. I know, you know, whatever it is that I want for myself, that's on the other side.

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[00:32:07] Natalie: a little bit about what you offer and how they can reach you. And of course, the links will all be in the show notes as well.

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[00:32:22] Jennifer: So that might be writing, it might be research, it might be wellness and motivation, you know, whatever it is, I work on it with students, um, to help them get to the end of their degrees. happily, not just to the end of degrees, but you know, happy and contented by the time they've got there. Um, people can find me on my website, which is www.

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[00:33:09] Natalie: Awesome. And that's all you can ask for. One problem off the plate is one, it's one problem less. And that's where you start. You start with one, right? I think a lot of times we're trying to do all these things and we're trying to change everything at the same time. It's too overwhelming and it's just not possible.

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